In article >,  > wrote:
| 
| I never heard about the condition on those weapons sold vis a vis the
| ones that remained, but overall I thought it was a good move by
| Jeszenszky and it served national interest.  What I consider wrong is
| that the SZDSZ used that national security issue for its own narrow
| political interest to embarrass the Antall government.  Very close to
| treason in my book.


Ya... like it doesn't happen everywhere everytime.

Treason? Gimme a break.. I guess it would fit how the
communists defined treason, but  I didn't think your
definitions followed theirs.

Istvan

Hi, Joe, HipCat et al!

Just posted this to the Hungary List and thought you might find the info of
interest over here on SCM. I would also be interested in hearing any comments.

Tisztelettel,

Johanne/Janka

>Date: Thu, 05 Dec 1996 20:23:49
>To: Hungarian Discussion List >
>From: "Johanne L. Tournier" >
>Subject: Re: The English Patient
>
>Hi, Jesse!
>
>At 08:18 04/12/96 GMT, you wrote:
>>Johanne L. Tournier ) wrote:
>>: Hungarian name (I think it may be Dutch and that he originally came from
>>: South Africa, but I am not positive), would have selected such a small
>>: country to be the homeland of his hero. Does anybody have any ideas?
>>
>>Ondaatje is a Dutch name, but he is native to Sri Lanka.  Fabulous novel,
>>by the way.
>>
>>Best,
>>Jesse
>
>Thanks for the info. I intend to read the book first, before seeing the movie!
>
>BTW, people might be interested to know that I heard part of a commentary
on CBC radio today in which a gentleman whose name I did not catch was
criticizing the fact that the Almasy of the movie was portrayed as a
romantic dreamer who is so in love that, in order to save his lady fair, he
collaborates with the Nazis. This gentleman says that the *real* Almasy
willingly collaborated with the Nazis and that books and movies should be
truer to the historical truth of these things. I thought that was
interesting, because it indicates that this Almasy was based on a historical
character. Maybe the same one who, according to someone on SCM, discovered
the Arabs of Hungarian descent living in Egypt in the 1920's. It would be
interesting to find out more about this historical Almasy (would it have
been spelled Almassy?). Does anyone know of any books which might tell about
his life and adventures?
>
>(I will cross-post this to SCM, to see if there are any comments from there).
>
>Tisztelettel,
>
>Johanne/Janka
>
Johanne L. Tournier
e-mail - 

Elnezest kerek az emelkedett szellemu soc.culture.magyar levtagjaitol,
de nem tudom megallni...:

"Szomoru vasarnap jott meg a folyasom
 Hetfore bedagadt mind a ket tojasom..."

sajnos a folytatasara nem emlekszem, medikus korunkban gajdoltuk bor
mellett, lenyegeben a gonoccocusos fertozes korlefolyasat hivatott
illusztralni...
( Caeterum censeo:de hiszen amit irtam soc. is, culture is, magyar is)
 Yours,pike

The nomination of Madeline Allbright to head the State Dept should be
good for East/Central European countries, IMHO.  (Especially for the
Czech republic, of course. ;-) With her background our old countries
should get a better and more realistic hearing at the White House and
other Western centers of power.

What do you think?

Joe Pannon

On 5 Dec 1996 12:53:21 -0800, BeeJay > wrote:

>On Thu, 5 Dec 1996, Ania Oleksik wrote:
>
>> On 4 Dec 1996 01:35:22 GMT,  () wrote:
>
>[American life only good for the rich and the companies, according to some
>frustrated cloggy who thinks he's speaking a German dialect]

Don't you think there's a large discrepancy between corporate America
and the average American citizen (after all, living standards ARE
going down or, at best, are status-quo for him).

>> >I wonder why then everybody wants to come here.  They should really talk
>> >to you first.
>> 
>> By far, the rest of the world would NOT want to live in the U.S.
>> Take me as an example.
>
>No, I will not take you as an example, because what you claim is in my
>humble opinion questionable. As far as I know the US are the most popular
>destination for migrants. It is also the most accessible destination in
>the Western world, as far as I know. 

Yep, as the Mexican would-be immigrants will be happy to confirm.

[snip]

>Yes, there's a drugs problem and there's a lot of poverty ("take me as an
>example"), but that doesn't make life necessarily unbearable.  

I suppose that's your personal opinion, as I can't imagine poor people
living in miserable circumstances will share your detached view ; the
LA riots are only a testimony.


"Life in Canada is wonderful - that is, if you happen to be a
pineapple".  :)

Didier Moens
Laboratory of Molecular Biology
Universiteit Gent - Belgium
Tel : 0032 9 264 53 09   Fax : 0032 9 264 53 48
E-Mail : 

In article >,  says...
>
>The nomination of Madeline Allbright to head the State Dept should be
>good for East/Central European countries, IMHO.  (Especially for the
>Czech republic, of course. ;-) With her background our old countries
>should get a better and more realistic hearing at the White House and
>other Western centers of power.
>
>What do you think?
>
>Joe Pannon

You are dreaming. Wake up and smell the daisies.

Mr. Kudla

[Posted and mailed]

In article >,
	Peter k Chong > writes:
> Olvastam, hogy Nadia Comaneci (Kemenes Ilona) egy magyar apja van 
> (Gheorgie Comaneci - Kemenes György) és ezért Ilona egy félszarmású 
> magyar. De azt nem hittem... Nadia Comaneci (fél)-magyar szarmású 
> ember-e? Régen hallottam ezt. Még nem biztos vagyok. 
> 
> Peter Chong
> 
> Ui. Mi történt Ilonával 1980 után? Kíváncsi vagyok...

 I only answer because you sent me this message also via e-mail.

1. You should know that "Ilona" has nothing to do with "Nadia". It would
translate as "Elena" in Romanian. So much about precision.

2. The Kemenes - Comaneci connection has proved to be nonexistent up
to now, aside from the possibility of common origin for the two names,
which has nothing to do with the ethnical origin of the person wearing
it.

3. In 1981 Nadia has still won at the Universiade, after that she
retired, in 1989 she left the country and today she lives in the USA
together with his husband, Burt Conner (also gymnast), whom she
married this year in Bucharest.

4. When looking for Hungarian connections in the Romanian gymnastics,
I really wonder why nobody cares about Kati Szabo, definitely not so
famous as Nadia, but still winner of countless medals in European and
World Championships, and winner of 3 or 4 gold medals at the Los
Angeles Olympic games in 1984? Now, what happened to her???

Zoli
-- 
http://dipmza.physik.uni-mainz.de/~gagyi_palffy/homepage.html

Az ARD (nemet TV 1. csatornaja) ezev okt. 22-en eredetiben felidezte
filmfelvetelrol Nagy Imre es Maleter Pal bucsuszavait, valamint
Vasarhelyi Miklos es Kopacsi Sandor zarszavat. Gondolom Nemetorszag es
kornyeken sok magyar nezte ,talan videon is felvette valaki, ezert en
nem is vallakozok arra,hogy emlekezetbol idezzem. 

 Nagy Imre es Maleter Pal ontudatosan,buszken emelt fovel vallalta a
martirhalalt.  A pufajkasok meg az utolso szavak filmfelvetelet is
megcsonkitottak, Nagy Imre beszede csak az elejen volt szinkronban a
keppel, utanna mar csak magnofelvetel volt kulon,hozzavalo kep nelkul.

Azutan jott Vasarhelyi Miklos es Kopacsi Sandor fellepeseben mar keveset
lehetett latni a forradalmi hosokbol, igen sok volt benne a"bocsassatok
meg elvtarsak" stb. Kopacsi Sandor eredetiben sirva adta elo a hos
szovjet katona tortenetet, aki par nappal a leszerelese elott ,
Budapesten esett el. Es igy tovabb. Igazi dinamit .

A szembesito interjuban Vasarhelyi vagy Kopacsi ugy fogalmazott, nem szo
szerint ,hogy talan jobb lett volna ,ha Nagy Imre is egy kicsit
"rugalmasabb" lett volna. A pufajkasok kozul szerepelt Horn Gyula
is,akinek allitolag testvere halt meg es oda van temetve a hires
parcellaba. Azt hogy, hogyan es foleg kinek az oldalan halt meg ,nem
reszletezte kulonosebben.
Ha netalan valaki felvette videon, magam is szeretnem megkapni az
eredeti felvetelt.
Udv
Nagy Zoltan

 wrote:
: The nomination of Madeline Allbright to head the State Dept should be
: good for East/Central European countries, IMHO.

<SNIP>

: What do you think?

there seems to be a dark patronage cloud over MA... i forget the details but 
it has to do with her previous appointment, her husband (?), and a payoff type 
of appointment to UN by wjc... until i see sunlight she remains in the murk...

janos

 () wrote:

>Alexander N. Bossy > wrote:

>>(That couldn't have been easy, given the political dwarves
>>who lead most of the west now.)  By accepting Romania as well as
>>Poland, the Czech Republic and Hungary, NATO effectively cuts a
>>revanchist Russia from the Balkans, giving those countries a chance to
>>settle down without too much medeling

>I sure agree on the political dwarf comment; it's pretty close to what I
>like to call them: political midgets.  Same difference ...

>I am still not certain though if Clinton can keep steadfast and resists
>Russian intimidations regarding NATO expansion on the schedule talked
>about.  This Prez is not known for strong principles.

Well, one in any case: re-election.

>There are too
>many syrene calls for appeasment of Russia.  Just like in the old days.

Agreed.

>The funniest part is that Russians keep talking as if NATO came to their
>borders by admitting those first tier countries, totally ignoring
>Ukraine and Belorus in between.

Well, if you consider Kalingrad, one can argue that Poland's adhession
to NATO would bring NATO to their borders.  On the other hand, Russia
lived for centuries without dreaming of annexing Koningsberg.

>BTW, Ukraine expresses no objection to
>Hungary's inclusion in NATO.  So go and figure ...

The problem, of course, is that Russia hasn't yet firmly abandoned its
imperialist past.  Since Ukraine isn't interested in any Central
European adventurism, it hasn't got any reason to worry about NATO
guaranteing Central Europe's independence.  In fact, Ukraine has far
more reason to worry about renewed Russian imperialism than Hungary,
Poland, the Czech Republic or Romania do.

Alexander

Jeroen M.W. van Dijk > wrote:
>
>As a Dutchman I must strongly say that Holland or Belgium is not a political 
>dwarf.

Sure they are!  It's easy to flirt with disaster knowing that the US
will save your ass from the consequences of your weakness or foolishness.
If it wasn't for the US, you might be talking in German at home now.

> And why don't you middle european countries get an own defense 
>organisation. As soon as the Russia becomes weak the first thing you do is 
>looking for a new master (the USA).

Judging from the differences in living standards, the new master is far
preferable.
>
>Don't you middle europeans don't know that USA is backrupt don't pay its 
>contributions to the international organisations.

As far as I am concerned, it's all money flushed down the toilet,
anyway.  With a few exceptions, those international organizations are a
joke.  Especially the UN itself.

Joe

On 5 Dec 1996 12:53:21 -0800, BeeJay > wrote:

>On Thu, 5 Dec 1996, Ania Oleksik wrote:
>
>> On 4 Dec 1996 01:35:22 GMT,  () wrote:
>
>[American life only good for the rich and the companies, according to some
>frustrated cloggy who thinks he's speaking a German dialect]

If it makes you feel better to call your opponents names, go ahead,
but don't expect us to take you seriously any longer. Why would Jeroen
be frustrated? He's just hot-tempered, and he may be wrong. But
there's no reason to attribute any vile motives to his opinion. Can
you remain reasonable?

>> >I wonder why then everybody wants to come here.  They should really talk
>> >to you first.
>> 
>> By far, the rest of the world would NOT want to live in the U.S.
>> Take me as an example.
>
>No, I will not take you as an example, because what you claim is in my
>humble opinion questionable. 

You only consider examples who agree with you? I guess you are far
away from any bachelor's or master's or PhD degree.

>As far as I know the US are the most popular
>destination for migrants. It is also the most accessible destination in
>the Western world, as far as I know. 

Yes. Time to wonder if you know enough to back up this assertion. If
not, it is empty. Everyone thinks his/her country is the most
accessible and takes up too many migrants. BTW, shall we relate
numbers to size of the country here? Or do you think this is an
irrelevant factor?

>> >>The most americans are living in their
>> >>self made dream of drugs and crime. 
>> >
>> >You shouldn't give yourself away this fast ...
>> >Any other jokes you might have, ing. Jeroen? 
>> 
>> Inadequate reply. Jeroen may exaggerate, but his argument
>> is valid that the U.S. has a VERY SERIOUS drug and poverty
>> problem. Also when compared to countries without capitalism
>> as its bible.
>
>Ahem, I personally think that Joe was responding to Van Dijk's
>*exaggeration*.

I agree with you ! (hooray) But that is exactly my point: Joe
addresses merely the exaggeration (I stated so) but not the argument
itself. That's why I call his reply inadequate (I avoided the word
'cheap).

>Yes, there's a drugs problem and there's a lot of poverty ("take me as an
>example"), but that doesn't make life necessarily unbearable.  
 
So you have come back from asserting that America is great period or
America is the best country for migrants or America is the best-loved
country in the world or whatever great things to say about America

to 

Life in America is bearable in spite of its problems with drugs and
poverty.

I think we have found agreement at the end of the line.

Let's celebrate.

Michel Couzijn
Amsterdam, The Netherlands (a great country, by the way...)